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 Post subject: What Nonsense!
 Post Posted: 13 Sep 2017, 07:23 
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Had to start a new thread as I did not know which of the negative moaning ones to choose where I could make a sane positive remark or two.
The funniest of them all was where someone says Holman should be playing! Forget his injury and stick him out there! Forster could do a job too I guess, with or without his crutches.
We are a few games into the season. We have had a load of injuries. (Forster Graham, Boyle Grimes Sellars Holman are the ones I can think of)The side has not had time to gel.
Someone says "panic last minute signings" then says that the Bristol City boys are our best players!
Unlike all the infallible with hindsight moaners I am desperately hoping that Paul Baker and the rest of he directors have the sense and wisdom to stay calm and to keep going with GJ. If not there is always Justin Edinburgh or possibly Cooper from FG who can come in and "do a job"
Keep at it Gary, it will come! A few wins and we are in the play off places!


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 Post subject: Re: What Nonsense!
 Post Posted: 13 Sep 2017, 07:37 
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Oldun, even the most optimistic, a camp which I would put you at the head of, must be scratching your head about the man management going on? Like I said elsewhere, more than happy to wait for the explanation around what was the logic behind hauling off DW at half time and putting HP up front. Surely, you must wonder at that one? Or is it a case of papal infallibilty. The major thing about your post that sets you well in the negative postings is your belief that we can only attract what you deem to be 'bad' managers. Where does that come from? What's the logic?
Not saying we need a new one, but if we did, I am sure we would have more options than those 2. After all, we got GJ the last time we went hunting!


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 Post subject: Re: What Nonsense!
 Post Posted: 13 Sep 2017, 07:39 
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If we had been reasonably successful last season then I would give him more time but this is just continuing from where we left off last season with no sign of any improvement


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 Post subject: Re: What Nonsense!
 Post Posted: 13 Sep 2017, 07:55 
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I think you have to temper last season regarding GJ - when he had his health issues we'd actually turned the corner and were playing well. It then led to Russ Milton taking charge of the team and, as much as I love Russ, he ain't no manager.

I'm usually one of the last on manager out bandwagons, I was with both Yates and Allen, but it's hard to see us turning the corner at the moment. Admittedly I've only seen the home games, and in those we haven't looked too bad, I put the Exeter defeat down to defensive errors and the Stevenage game down to one of those days. However, from what I've read about the second half last night, it really does appear that GJ is losing the plot. The evidence suggests as well that when he gets into this mode he never turns it around.

I'm prepared to give him a couple more games to turn it around, but if we're still stuck on 4/5 points after the Chesterfield game, then he simply has to go. His one saving grace at the moment is that we're not getting hammered - that could well change in the coming games.


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 Post subject: Re: What Nonsense!
 Post Posted: 13 Sep 2017, 08:21 
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Are Graham and Holman injured though? Or are they out of favour? It's more diplomatic to say a player is carrying a knock when you're asked why they can't make the subs bench

If Graham and Holman really are injured they must have done it in training. They looked fine last time I saw them play.


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 Post subject: Re: What Nonsense!
 Post Posted: 13 Sep 2017, 08:22 
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There is no doubt that we have been very unlucky with injuries and this has clearly had a disruptive effect on team morale. True, the goal drought is perplexing and a little alarming, though anyone who follows football knows this happens all the time and at all levels of the game. It is inexplicable how goals can dry up then, suddenly, everything clicks and they start going in again. The same happens at the other end of the pitch. There's no rhyme or reason, though confidence is obviously a major factor and, yes, player availability, team selection, tactics and so on...

It's ironic that the one game when we did score freely was also a game where we leaked lot of goals. We clearly have the ability to win games as shown when we tore Exeter to shreds in the first 30 mins. We should've won easily at Yeovil, but simply couldn't get that bit of luck to get the ball in the net. You can't blame the manager for that.

It's all too easy to look at our current league position and panic into a knee-jerk reaction. But, whatever people think, GJ does not become a bad manager overnight. I believe the current squad is as good as we've had for a long time and it's only a matter of time before things gel, the fickle finger of fate changes, and the results start improving. I know some will say that's complacent or the words of someone who lacks passion for the club. Eau contraire. It is much too early to write the season off. Yes, we were heavily defeated at Carlisle but we have competed well in all the other games. Changing the manager might have an instant impact but, time and again, that proves to be a temporary fillip before 'normal service' is resumed. It is far less risky to stick with a manager with a good track record and is probably better than any we could realistically attract to this club.


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 Post subject: Re: What Nonsense!
 Post Posted: 13 Sep 2017, 08:31 
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I certainly do not advocate sacking GJ however results are simply not good enough and the board must be looking at contingencies should this awful run continue. Performances in the main haven't been bad, sounds like we were the better team in the first half and very even in the second half last night so it's only Carlisle where we've been outplayed so there is hope however results must improve quickly because bottom six in this league is unacceptable.


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 Post subject: Re: What Nonsense!
 Post Posted: 13 Sep 2017, 08:32 
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I repeat..."What Nonsense!" To which I would add "What arrogance!" All these so called supporters who know better! Maybe, just maybe Gary reached the point last night where he could see that we were unlikely to score with DW et al so thought he'd try something a bit "left field" Maybe he did it to spite all the moaners. Or should he have sent for the injured Dan H? The Nest beggars belief!
Give him one more game? Absolute arrogant nonsense!!!!Nonsense nonsense nonsense! If we are in bottom three or four at Christmas maybe. But please no knee jerk actions now or after Saturday. 46 games this season in the league. Give the man and the team some slack please!
As said, I am sure PB has much too much sense to listen to any of this and I can see and understand why Ben2 decided to give us all a wide berth!

PS Just read latest drgm post. Glad to see the mistrust is reaching wider and deeper! Another "plot" we need to think about? Vickery on the other hand is the voice of reason!


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 Post subject: Re: What Nonsense!
 Post Posted: 13 Sep 2017, 08:45 
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I have always been an advocate of giving managers time and supporting them up until when they are sacked. Allen, Yates, Buckle..long live the king, the king is dead, long live the king.

What have I learned? That hanging on too long is damaging. Giving managers too much time took us from League One to the Conference. I won't advocate such a mistake again.

Whilst I won't call for Gary to be sacked yet, I won't campaign in his behalf either.


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 Post subject: Re: What Nonsense!
 Post Posted: 13 Sep 2017, 09:02 
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Oldun wrote:
I repeat..."What Nonsense!" To which I would add "What arrogance!" All these so called supporters who know better! Maybe, just maybe Gary reached the point last night where he could see that we were unlikely to score with DW et al so thought he'd try something a bit "left field" Maybe he did it to spite all the moaners. Or should he have sent for the injured Dan H? The Nest beggars belief!
Give him one more game? Absolute arrogant nonsense!!!!Nonsense nonsense nonsense! If we are in bottom three or four at Christmas maybe. But please no knee jerk actions now or after Saturday. 46 games this season in the league. Give the man and the team some slack please!
As said, I am sure PB has much too much sense to listen to any of this and I can see and understand why Ben2 decided to give us all a wide berth!

PS Just read latest drgm post. Glad to see the mistrust is reaching wider and deeper! Another "plot" we need to think about? Vickery on the other hand is the voice of reason!

So because someone has a different opinion to you its nonsense? That's arrogance... everyone is entitled to their opinion just because it doesn't match yours its nonsense?


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 Post subject: Re: What Nonsense!
 Post Posted: 13 Sep 2017, 09:11 
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Still a little early in the season to make a sensible judgement; but beginning to veer to a change in management. Mainly due to the odd decisions in 'subs'; certainly last season and apparently this plus 'new' signings and loans. Looking at teams recently promoted to Lg2 only York have disappeared off the radar. Others comfortably in mid-table or better and a couple [Fleetwood and Bristol Rovers] promoted. What is it that they have right and we haven't - mainly I suspect a clearer idea of squad potential, their signings and playing round pegs in well fitting round holes.


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 Post subject: Re: What Nonsense!
 Post Posted: 13 Sep 2017, 09:22 
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theidlerich wrote:
Still a little early in the season to make a sensible judgement; but beginning to veer to a change in management. Mainly due to the odd decisions in 'subs'; certainly last season and apparently this plus 'new' signings and loans. Looking at teams recently promoted to Lg2 only York have disappeared off the radar. Others comfortably in mid-table or better and a couple [Fleetwood and Bristol Rovers] promoted. What is it that they have right and we haven't - mainly I suspect a clearer idea of squad potential, their signings and playing round pegs in well fitting round holes.


Fleetwood: moneybags owner

Rovers: decades more history in the Leagues and a fanbase on a different level to ours

If anything, given we have had two promotions, and two other play-offs, in 18 years as a league side, there will be many teams in L2 and L1 wondering "how come Cheltenham have been so successful so often in so few years - what have they done right which we haven't".


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 Post subject: Re: What Nonsense!
 Post Posted: 13 Sep 2017, 09:55 
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Oldun, I take it that is the last time we see DW then folowing your logic?
I would have thought left field would be playing two smaller strikers? No matter what sport, when the wind is blowing, ball is kept low. Hence why HP


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 Post subject: Re: What Nonsense!
 Post Posted: 13 Sep 2017, 10:32 
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confused.com wrote:
Oldun, I take it that is the last time we see DW then folowing your logic?
I would have thought left field would be playing two smaller strikers? No matter what sport, when the wind is blowing, ball is kept low. Hence why HP


I wasn't there but can't recall many times in L2 a successful team has had 2 smaller strikers. You only have to look at the current goalscoring charts Reid, Coulthirst, Collins, Jackson, Nouble, Porter and I would wager that all or all but one are 6ft +. It's the way L2 is - and if it is a smaller one scoring, there is normally a bigger one next to them!!


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 Post subject: Re: What Nonsense!
 Post Posted: 13 Sep 2017, 11:03 
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We have had a lot of new players in and I doubt that, if you asked Gary, he still probably doesn't know what is his best starting X1. I agree with a lot of what the Oldun has said but the lack of goals is a concern for me. I personally don't think chopping and changing players up front is the way to a settled 'strike force'. Confidence is all part of goal scoring but how are strikers supposed to gain confidence by being subbed/benched? Pick what you think is your best strike force and have confidence in it. Generally, if keepers drop a couple of clangers they don't get subbed so why a striker? I think once we find a way to score goals we'll be on our way.


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 Post subject: Re: What Nonsense!
 Post Posted: 13 Sep 2017, 11:08 
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How many goals have we scored in total since Eisa signed his new contract?


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 Post subject: Re: What Nonsense!
 Post Posted: 13 Sep 2017, 11:14 
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3


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 Post subject: Re: What Nonsense!
 Post Posted: 13 Sep 2017, 11:16 
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drgm wrote:
If we had been reasonably successful last season then I would give him more time but this is just continuing from where we left off last season with no sign of any improvement

Give the manager time ! Is 14 months enough ?


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 Post subject: Re: What Nonsense!
 Post Posted: 13 Sep 2017, 11:32 
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Choirboy, was not advocating it for the rest of the season. If you re read, it was because of the weather conditions and as an alternative to an ariel ball to an impromptu centre forward?


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 Post subject: Re: What Nonsense!
 Post Posted: 13 Sep 2017, 12:54 
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My bad. Shouldn't have quoted you. Was more generic as have seen a few others talk about playing two small ones.


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 Post subject: Re: What Nonsense!
 Post Posted: 13 Sep 2017, 15:04 
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Oldun wrote:

PS Just read latest drgm post. Glad to see the mistrust is reaching wider and deeper! Another "plot" we need to think about? Vickery on the other hand is the voice of reason!
***********************

Sorry no 'plot' as far as I am concerned. It just seems like the obvious thing to put the blame on an injury when some players don't make the bench. I can't imagine Gary saying 'Holman's not on the bench because he's not good enough'. Blaming some fictitious injury just seems to be the sensible option.
As for injuries -all teams get them. The trick is to have enough cover.

As for the players - I would say we have enough quality not to be struggling. Even Cranston is playing better these days.

Our budget should be ok for this level. We have a harmonious and prudently run club. We have boardroom stability. I'm not expecting us to be challenging in the play-off positions but we really should be doing better than another season of struggle. The idea we can't attract good candidates for the managers job is laughable really. We could hardly do any worse than we are at the moment.

I'd give Gary a few more games but that would be it for me.


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 Post subject: Re: What Nonsense!
 Post Posted: 13 Sep 2017, 16:25 
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If memory serves me well, we were hardly pulling up trees in the goal scoring front last season. We're we not one of the lowest! Cba to look


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 Post subject: Re: What Nonsense!
 Post Posted: 13 Sep 2017, 16:49 
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confused.com wrote:
If memory serves me well, we were hardly pulling up trees in the goal scoring front last season. We're we not one of the lowest! Cba to look


I can almost guarantee we would be near the bottom for goals scored last season without checking also. It is however still a concern that we can continue to have goal scoring issues after an entire season. I'm all for giving Gary more time as its daft to want someone sacked after 7 games. But we must see an improvement in the goal scoring department or it will have to be seriously considered, as i mentioned before- it doesn't matter how well we play, as long as we get results and move up the table. You could play like barcelona every game but if you don't score you will get relegated.

I believe that Johnson can turn this around. But for me he is definitely running out of time to do so, all we can continue to do is support the team and hope the change starts on saturday :)


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 Post subject: Re: What Nonsense!
 Post Posted: 13 Sep 2017, 16:54 
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Agree re last year, was to put in to context the debate that it's only a matter of time until the goals flow, ,,,


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 Post subject: Re: What Nonsense!
 Post Posted: 13 Sep 2017, 22:08 
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I don't want to see him sacked but we're just so poor and poor decisions are costing us, I've never known a football club to make so many mistakes on and off the field almost every season, it is an absolute disgrace, it's no wonder people in this town don't support this club, they're not interested because the level of football we tend to produce is average. That Exeter team that came up a couple of weeks ago was one of the worst teams I have ever seen, even when they were winning they were terrible, and yet we lost, you couldn't make it up. I wish for one season where we have a winning team with few bad decisions (everybody makes mistakes at all levels it can't be helped, we're all human) and a team to go home and be proud of.


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 Post subject: Re: What Nonsense!
 Post Posted: 13 Sep 2017, 22:43 
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Yeh agree mate its a joke now embarissing to be a fan.


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 Post subject: Re: What Nonsense!
 Post Posted: 14 Sep 2017, 09:49 
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3 - and none by the wonderland.

And only conceded 2 I think, so hardly major problems with the team. Just need a spark from somewhere.


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 Post subject: Re: What Nonsense!
 Post Posted: 14 Sep 2017, 09:55 
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CTFC03 wrote:
I don't want to see him sacked but we're just so poor and poor decisions are costing us, I've never known a football club to make so many mistakes on and off the field almost every season, it is an absolute disgrace, it's no wonder people in this town don't support this club, they're not interested because the level of football we tend to produce is average. That Exeter team that came up a couple of weeks ago was one of the worst teams I have ever seen, even when they were winning they were terrible, and yet we lost, you couldn't make it up. I wish for one season where we have a winning team with few bad decisions (everybody makes mistakes at all levels it can't be helped, we're all human) and a team to go home and be proud of.


That Exeter team are three points clear at the top, won 6 out of seven.

So if they were that awful it goes to show the fine margins we are discussing here.


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